After a few days of using Skinceuticals’ new Phloretin CF instead of my beloved Skinceuticals CE Ferulic,
I have come to a surprising decision on what works best: using both together!
After speaking to a friend in the beauty business, it was suggested that perhaps Skinceuticals manufactured Phloretin CF without vitamin E so that CE Ferulic fans would buy Phloretin CF in addition to, rather than instead of, CE Ferulic. This logic also made since because my (normal, somewhat sensitive) skin felt awfully dry after three days’ use of solely Phloretin CF. However, during that time, I felt that Phloretin CF on its own made my undereye skin look somewhat firmer.
For the next week, I used Phloretin CF and CE Ferulic together, with the product with the thinner consistency (Phloretin CF) underneath. The results really were extraordinary: my skin looks extremely smooth, to the point that indoor light reflects from it. The sunspot under my right eye (from a childhood vacation in Florida, don’t ask, haha) also looks a bit lighter. I personally love the idea of getting 2% phloretin, 10% vitamin C as L-ascorbic acid, and 0.5% ferulic acid in Phloretin CF and also 1% vitamin E as tocopherol acetate, 15% vitamin C as L-ascorbic acid, and 0.5% ferulic acid in CE Ferulic. There is no known reported research indicating that the mixture can in any way be detrimental to the skin.
However, for the record, Skinceuticals states that Phloretin CF and CE Ferulic are made to address “different photo-aging concerns and skin types.” According to a recent company brochure, the new Phloretin CF is designed:
- for oily, problematic, and normal skin
- to diminish age spots and other forms of hyperpigmentation
- to accelerate cell renewal
- to improve laxity
- to retexturize skin
On the other hand, according to the brochure, CE Ferulic is best suited:
- for dry, combination, and normal skin
- to replenish lipids
- to stimulate collagen synthesis
- to reduce fine lines and wrinkles
With that said, I offer the following advice: If you have normal skin, and can afford to use both products, I would do so to get increased antioxidant protection, increased skin firmness, and truly advanced hyperpigmentation treatment. (And I am not affiliated with Skinceuticals in any way, so I am saying this as an unbiased, unpaid recommendation! 
) However, if you have dry skin, I would recommend only CE Ferulic, because Phloretin CF tends to dry out the skin. And, if you have oily skin, I would conversely recommend trying both Phloretin CF and CE Ferulic, because CE Ferulic is not as hydrating as Phloretin CF is drying. However, if your oily skin breaks out after using CE Ferulic, then definitely use only Phloretin CF. (Get your CE Ferulic from a company with a forgiving return policy like Amazon!)
I am truly loving my Phloretin CF and CE Ferulic in combination, and I hope that you find this post helpful too!
P.S.– Keep commenting! The FutureDerm and Skinmedix.com $500 skincare giveaway is this Friday, June 19, 2008!
Combining CE and Phloretin together? Well this is when the 500$ gift can come in handy lol.
If I have normal skin, and could only reasonably justify trying 1- which one would you recommend over the other?
do you advise to use this in our morning regimen or night? Or both?
I was hoping I would know which one to buy! I guess the CE Ferulic would still be your favorite?
I’ve been dying to try the CE Ferulic but haven’t been able to get myself to spend the money on it. There are so many products I want to try and test, but lack of money gets in the way:(
YAY! I was wondering about the ability to use the two together because they both sound great, and now I know. Even if I don’t win, when I make a another order, this will be part of it. Thank you for checking it out!!!
I have been using Phloretin CF for the last couple days. I do agree that it is a bit drying (especially compared to the CE Ferulic). I have some hyperpigmentation from being out in the sun as a teenager so hopefully it will help with that… right now it’s too early to tell. I do like the idea of trying different antioxidants so I’ve decided to use this in the AM and CE Ferulic in the PM. Also, applying the SkinCeuticals B5 gel after this product (Phloretin) works to add moisture back to the skin. I then put my moisturizer over that.
One more thing… there were some comments/questions about buying SkinCeuticals produts online. I normally purchase from Skinmedix… they do sell the new Phloretin CF. This product is new to the market so they must not be only selling last year’s stock. I’m confused as I thought SkinCeuticals did not have any current online contracts.
Maybe using Phloretin under eye area and CE all over for sunscreen boost would be a good combination.
I have dry skin, so CE Ferulic would probably be best for me.
How long would you say a bottle lasts? I’m wondering whether including it in my skin care regime would be worth the price.
I’m quoting an Amazon shop on CE Ferulic:
“When very fresh = recently manufactured, the C E Ferulic is a very clear liquid. It turns yellow with exposure to heat, light and air, so this does definitely NOT mean that the product is old or expired (unless it is very dark). The samples vials AND the full sized bottles all turn yellow and then even orange if you keep them long enough. You can STILL use them at this stage. This means the vitamin C and Ferulic acid are oxidized. To keep them clear as long as possible, we suggest you keep them in the refrigerator (like all vitamin C skincare products). This will keep them clear and ultra fresh, thus useable for a longer period of time. Most of Prestige-Beautica’s Ferulic will arrive to you totally clear because none of them stays long enough on our shelves.”
Is this actually true? Is there still a point in using this product when the vit. C and ferulic are oxidized?
Thanks Nicki – I have excessively oily skin so the Phloretin sounds like it may help with this issue. I apppreciate your continuing updates so much.
I am using CE Ferulic now. Next time I’ll try both. Wish it was not so expensive.
Are people using the CE Ferulic during the day, or overnight while sleeping?
Which way is best, and why? Recommendations?
Answering some questions:
-the products are for AM use especially since they give your sunscreen a boost
- many companys claim that when the vit C turned yellow/brown it’s still okay to use…which is not true…oxidation = no more AOX
- A 1 oz bottle lasts about 2 months+! But like many people do I would suggest to by the samples bottles! 6 samples = 1 oz and you can put the other 5 in the frigde while you use one. this can also be very handy to minimise oxidation problems
- Some companys claim that vit C stays active on the skin for 72 hours, others say 24 hours…Whoever is right, I don’t know but if you use it every morning and indeed it lasts for 72 hours it means you use build the Vit C up which is always good.
- Tip: Before I go to a party I always put some CE Ferulic on, it always makes sure I stay zit free the day after because of the alcohol, smoke, heat,….! Perfect!
I just ordered my Phloretin…I can’t wait to use it alone or in combination with my CE Ferulic! Thanks Nicki!
Very interesting information. Thanks!
)
Now what do you recommend in the case where you have dry skin and hyperpigmentation? (Fabulous combination, I know!
Do you have an opinion about the Dr. Varon serums? They seem similar to Skinceuticals, but the price points are extremely different.
I wonder whether other companies will start using this new antioxidant? I’d love to have some choice, since the price is high on this line. Thanks for the experimentation for us, Nikki!
Great review, and what a great idea combining the 2 products. I definitely want to give this a try. I love the CEF, and I still have hyperpigmentation to get rid of. Thanks for the review and the tip!
Thanks Nikki!! This is really helpful info in deciding which product would be better. I have acne-prone skin, and I am really cautious about what I put on it and this information helps me to be better informed!! Keep it coming!!
these both sound like great products, but my sensitive skin couldn’t handle both together probably. We need some generic, cheaper products-pronto.
I think that you need to maybe use a smaller dose to get used to the product? When I first tried my mom’s ce ferulic, I was turned off by the smell– but my mother raves about it so I can’t wait to be able to try this for myself!
I think the reason why tocopherol was omitted from Phloretin CF is that highly acne- and clog-prone people can break out from tocopherol. But, the cynic in me can also believe that SkinCeuticals wants us to buy both C+E Ferulic and Phloretin.
Sara — I’ve also been very curious about how Skinmedix is able to sell Phloretin after SkinCeuticals supposedly chose not to renew any of its contracts with online dealers (which I think was a terrible mistake). I hope Skinmedix continues to carry SkinCeuticals — I don’t think I’d use this line anymore if I couldn’t buy it at a discount.
After reading this post and checking out the over whelming positive reviews on the net on Skinceuticals CE Ferulic, I decided to take the plunge and invest my dollars in a bottle. I am very eager to receive it so I can try it out!! I’m also in the process of purchasing the new Phloretin CF (I thought I’d sleep on it after just paying top dollar for the Ferulic). Here’s to having great skin (which I have yet to achieve!)
I have used SkinCeuticals for a few years now and love their serums. I asked about the color change before and was told by the company that the color change DOES NOT indicate lack of effectiveness. They did a test that showed it was still 90% effective after being left open and in an oven for like one month. That sold me!
Also if the company has stopped selling to big internet sites that means the only way one of those sites is selling it is by getting it from another source. You figure it out.
Anyway, you don’t have to use both serums to get good antioxidants. Just pick one or I guess you could alternate days. I like them both, but probably won’t buy both at the same time.
Skinceuticals C E Ferulic is a very well formulated product. For those who want to benefit from a formula like Skinceuticals C E Ferulic, but can’t or don’t want to spend $100 on a product, consider making the product yourself. It’s simple, choose a base cream, then add L-Ascorbic acid, Vitamin E, and Ferulic acid. You can get these ingredients cheap at http://www.SkinCareByYou.com
How to you respond to the following comment from Paula Begoun’s website:
“Although there are compelling reasons to consider phloretin as another potent, beneficial antioxidant to improve skin’s appearance and healthy functioning, in the case of this product it is completely wasted. Why? Because the amount of denatured alcohol in this serum negates any antioxidant benefit phloretin has. Its inclusion is extremely disappointing. Alcohol causes free-radical damage, cell death, and irritation. That does not help skin in the least and, in fact, makes matters worse.
Bottom line: phloretin may be the antioxidant du jour, but not in this product. Please keep in mind that despite the published research for phloretin and Skinceuticals claims, it is not the best antioxidant to “attack damage on every level” there are lots of brilliant antioxidants in skin care products, there isn’t a miracle or magic bullet out there.”
Hi Nicki,
Is it safe to use CE Ferulic with Estee Lauder Idealist Pore Minimizing Skin Refinisher, because I am concerned about the dark spots on my face and the pore size. I am in mid 20, do you think I am too young to start using these products? Do you think CE Ferulic will help removing dark spots on my face? If not, what is the most effective way to remove them while using Estee Lauder Idealist Pore Minimizing Skin Refinisher ? Thanks!
Hi Nicki,
I have been reading your blog a lot about the antioxidants by Skinceuticals (Phloretin CF, CE Ferulic) and how beneficial they are to your skincare routine. However, I have also read on another website (derm.net.au)that no Vit. C antioxidant is effective because of oxidation. This is what Peter (a regular on the forum) said when asked about CE Ferulic:
“The main concerns with this sort of product are:
* what does applying oxidized Vitamin to the skin do (some is always oxidized)?
* how do you know you aren’t doing harm you can’t see in the first 4-6-12+ months of use?
* what is the ideal dose when daily requirements of protection vary, excess antioxidants can be pro-oxidant and the product contents are going to be variable and not regulated anyway?
The Skinceuticals CE Ferulic you mention is funded by L’Oreal.
Personally I am not comfortable with people using products like CE Ferulic unless their skin is objectively assessed 2-3 times a year.
Due to a lack of knowledge and resources a lot of people’s skins have been hurt by injudicious enthusiastic “cosmeceutical” use.
You are probably better off leaving your skin care as-is unless you can obtain bonafide care and assessment.”
Reading different opinions can be so confusing. What to do?
Thanks for your input.
Carolyn
Hi Carolyn,
Although those are definitely good points, I like to refer to the published studies on Cellex-C and combinations of C&E identical to CE Ferulic, which demonstrate that the combination has all of the benefits described in the blog post above. However, I certainly understand why some people are against vitamin C in serum, as it can pro-oxidize; yet, I choose to use it, keeping it tightly sealed, stored in a cool and dark place, and using it only when it is clear/pale yellow, never if it is dark yellow or light orange.
Hope that this helps – I’ll let you know if a more definitive answer emerges.
Thanks, Nicki, for your response. In your blog I read about Dr. Neal Schultz’ website dermtv.com. I went to it and watched almost all of the episodes and became even more confused as he instructed not to use topical antioxidants during the day but only at night. He also said to always put the sunscreen on first so it is the first product on your skin and then put your other products on over the sunscreen. Because I had read and heard differently, I sent him a question and this was his response to me today:
“Carolyn,
Thank you for your support and kind words concerning the website. While it is true topical antioxidants containing l-ascorbic acid are less stable then other forms of Vitamin C, they take months to oxidize in the bottle even after the bottle has been opened, so you are not wasting your money. However do not leave the bottles open and do not leave them in direct sunlight.
And yes, the sunscreen product should always be put on first, but sunscreen and antioxidant serum are really never used together because sunscreen is always used during the day and antioxidant serums work best when used at night. Remember what we said about protecting your antioxidant bottle from sunlight; you also don’t want the antioxidant product on your skin to be in direct sunlight because the sunlight will damage it. You want to put your antioxidant on at bedtime when there is no sunlight so that it can absorb into the skin and do its protection inside the skin during the day .
Lastly, retinoid products are themselves very fragile and often destroyed by glycolic acid, so you are correct that you should not be using your glycolic acid and retinoid product at the same time.
Have a good weekend,
Neal”
So, what do you think? I emailed him back and said according to the Skinceuticals website, for CE Ferulic & Phloretin CF use, it says: “Once in the morning after cleansing, apply 4-5 drops to a dry face, neck and chest. Follow with SkinCeuticals Hydrating B5 Gel and a SkinCeuticals moisturizer and sunscreen.” This is contradictory to his advice. I also asked him if I was on a PM regimen of Retin-A & hydroquinone, then where would the topical antioxidant fit into the PM regimen. I haven’t heard back from him on these issues.
I’m just trying to get all these products and their proper usage (order and time of application) down so that I can experience the most effectiveness.
Thanks again for your time and attention to these issues.
Carolyn